A quick look at some of Macworld's reader comments surrounding the launch of the new MacBooks tells its own story: "Seriously, how stupid does Apple think we are" said Alex; "once again we are struck by 'rip off Britain' it's disgusting how we are treated" said David; and "I have no problem paying extra for the Mac brand, the problem is when they announce lower prices, and yet the UK store prices go up." said TW, Colchester.
We think it's fair to say that there is general discomfort surrounding Apple's latest laptop launch; amongst both consumers and business partners.
With regards to pricing, complaints seem to hover around three main points of consternation:
- First: The price of MacBooks has risen across the board and there is a general concern that they are now "too expensive" compared to the models they replace.
- Second: This price increase has not occurred in the US therefore we are living in "rip-off Britain".
- Third: The white MacBook that saw its price slashed in America by $100 now actually costs more in the UK than it did before the announcement. Again, "rip-off Britain" but also rip-off Apple for increasing the price of a product.
So let's start with the first problem. The situation is that the price of Apple's MacBooks has – across the board – risen by around £100-£200 per machine. The sole exception being the MacBook Air with SSD drive, which has seen a price drop of £229 (largely reflective of the falling price of SSD drives).
Direct comparisons are, of course, somewhat unfair because the new machines offer vastly improved feature sets (with the exception of FireWire, which we're dealing with elsewhere). Most notably the MacBook now has a rather impressive graphics card and new unibody casing. In short, it is a different machine to the model it replaces. This may go some way to explaining why the mid-range model MacBook shows the largest price discrepancy. Here is a complete breakdown of comparable products and prices.
Prices for Apple's range of MacBooks have increased across the board
Old vs New MacBook price comparison
- Old MacBook White 2.1GHz £699
- New MacBook White 2.1GHz £719
Price difference £20 increase
- Old MacBook White 2.4GHz £829
- New MacBook 2.0GHz £949
Price difference £120 increase
- Old MacBook Black 2.4 GHz £949
- New MacBook 2.4 GHz £1,149
Price difference £200 increase
- Old MacBook Pro 2.4GHz £1,299
- New MacBook Pro 2.4GHz £1,399
Price difference £100 increase
- Old MacBook Pro 2.5GHz £1,599
- New MacBook Pro 2.53GHz £1,749
Price difference £150 increase
- Old MacBook Air 1.6GHz £1,199
- New MacBook Air 1.6GHz £1,299
Price difference £100 increase
- Old MacBook Air 1.8GHz £2,028
- New MacBook Air 1.8GHz £1,799
Price difference £229 decrease
Apple has long used product upgrades to maintain price structures and phase out products with older technology, rather than go the route of continuously pushing down prices. As Steve Jobs famously said on the launch of the iMac: "it is next year's computer for $1,299, not last year's computer for $999."
So in that context, the high price of the replacement range is hardly new or unexpected. It is perhaps a little controversial given the current economic climate, but it's Apple's call as to whether it goes down the premium-priced product route (that has worked for it in the past), or the lower priced product route that some customers wish it would go down.
The company has consistently compared itself to the Mercedes Benz and BMWs of this world, rather than the Honda or Ford-style car manufacturers so in this sense it is consistent with Apple – even if we'd all like to be able to afford a new MacBook.
Rip off Britain?
Of course, the real consternation is regarding the pricing structure in the UK when compared to the US. Which brings us on to point two: "This price increase has not occurred in the US therefore we are living in rip-off Britain".
As one Macworld reader called Duncan said: "I don't get it. As far as I recall the old mid-range white MacBook retailed at $1,299 in US and £839 in UK. Now the entry-level aluminium version retails at $1,299 in US and £949 in UK. What happened to the dollar overnight?" Good question. Well it may not have happened overnight, but the dollar to pound exchange has changed dramatically over the last 12 months, as a visit to exchangerate.com testifies.
The US to UK exchange rate over the last 12 months, from www.exchangerate.com
Put simply, a year ago today (17 October 2007) £1 would give you $2.05 (and rising) whereas today (18 October 2008) £1 gives you $1.73.
Taxing situation
And, as the more astute of our readers pointed out, there is also the tax difference between the United States and the UK. Prices in the UK contain VAT (currently at 17.5 per cent). So if a product costs £235 the retailer gives £35 of that straight to the government. Americans (who are probably horrified by that amount) may want to take pause for thought at the 25 per cent that the Swedish pay or the 19.6 per cent that the French government charges.
America however, is a diverse country and VAT (or Sales Tax, as they call it) is set independently at state, and even, county level. Alaska has 0 per cent, rising to 9.4 per cent in Tennessee.
To save confusion, Sales Tax is not included in the price but added afterwards. So if you buy a laptop marked at $1000 in a shop window in Iowa (with sales tax set at 5 per cent) you actually pay $1,050 when you get to the till.
So when doing a price comparison between the US and the UK you must add 17.5 per cent onto the US price for an accurate price comparison. If you do this you find that the price difference between the two areas narrows dramatically. But there is still a mark-up between 4.49 per cent and 9.08 per cent. Although this seems quite small, the mark-up of 9.08 per cent accounts for £86.16 of the price of the new MacBook – that's a considerable saving that would make the new MacBook a more palatable £863.
Here is a table that shows the US price, the US price converted to UK currency, the addition of the 17.5 per cent VAT and the comparison with the UK price.
| US Price | US to UK at $1 = £0.57 | US Price Plus UK VAT | Actual UK price | Percentage difference | |
| MacBook White 2.1 | $999.00 | £569.43 | £669.08 | £719.00 | 7.46 |
| MacBook 2.0 | $1,299.00 | £740.43 | £870.01 | £949.00 | 9.08 |
| MacBook 2.4 | $1,599.00 | £911.43 | £1,070.93 | £1,149.00 | 7.29 |
| MacBook Pro 2.4 | $1,999.00 | £1,139.43 | £1,338.83 | £1,399.00 | 4.49 |
| MacBook Pro 2.53 | $2,499.00 | £1,424.43 | £1,673.71 | £1,749.00 | 4.50 |
| MacBook Air 1.6 | $1,799.00 | £1,025.43 | £1,204.88 | £1,299.00 | 7.81 |
| MacBook Air 1.8 | $2,499.00 | £1,424.43 | £1,673.71 | £1,799.00 | 7.49 |
Why the difference?
Some people have attributed this difference to import duty, but so far as we can tell this isn't the case. We called HM Revenue and Customs to check and laptops under 10KG in weight are "Zero Rated" for import duty (ref code: 8471300000).
It is more likely that the price difference can be put down to the higher cost overall of doing business in the UK. When we quizzed Steve Jobs about the price difference of the iPhone in the UK versus the US he explained that the vast majority of it was Sales Tax (or VAT) and a smaller amount was simply "because it's a little bit more expensive to do business here; to move stuff around and service product." Here is Steve Jobs making the explanation:
We asked Apple for its stance on the situation, while the company is usually reticent about pricing Apple's Tanya Ridd did offer us this "official line" on Apple's price structure:
"Prices in the US are quoted excluding tax and prices in the UK are quoted including tax. Other factors influencing pricing include currency exchange rates, local import laws, business practices, taxes and the cost of doing business. These factors vary from region to region and over time, such that international prices are not always comparable to US suggested retail prices."
The price discrepancy may not have attracted quite so much ire if it wasn't for the unfortunate (and somewhat surprising) retention of a white MacBook model with its price slashed by $100 in the States but upped by £20 in the UK. Again, this can largely be put down to the difference in the exchange rate with a bit added on for the "higher cost of doing business in the UK".
However, we feel our reader's ire is somewhat justified. After all, it is fair to expect the price of technology to go down over time. This is why Apple tends to make models obsolete when it launches new ones; so it can maintain its prices and – we assume – its high margins.
Customers interested in the white MacBook can take a small measure of comfort in the knowledge that it is a higher-spec machine than the entry-level model it replaces. The combo CD/DVD drive has been replaced with a SuperDrive so we can finally wave goodbye to the age of CD burning. Still, we think Apple could have saved itself a whole bunch of trouble by somehow keeping it at the £699 mark – but we suspect this would have impacted its profit level in a way that its accountancy department felt unacceptable.
It is worth remembering this quote from iTunes VP Eddie Cue when faced with demands for higher royalties from artists:
"Apple has repeatedly made it clear that it is in this business to make money, and most likely would not continue to operate if it were no longer possible to do so profitably."
Food for thought
While it would be easy to end on that note, we do have a couple of thoughts for our readers. One is for investors or companies with a vested interest in Apple: will the new MacBooks sell as well as the old ones? Some analysts think not, but Apple's success over the last few years has frequently defied naysayers, and it's possible that the new MacBooks will drive the Mac platform forward. Time will tell.
The other thought is for consumers looking to buy a new MacBook. Those seriously disgruntled at the price can always opt to purchase a Windows or Linux-based laptop, but that raises the question of how much is OS X and Apple's propriety software worth? Most of the Macworld team couldn't switch to either of these operating systems. Even if it you did you may find that comparable laptops aren't that much cheaper. Direct comparisons are also difficult at the moment because the Nvidia 9400m graphics card can only be found in the MacBooks for the time being. As PC laptops arrive with similar specifications we will be able to do a closer analysis.
Heading over the pond?
Alternatively, you can always purchase a laptop from America, either by mail order or when you are visiting the country. You are legally responsible to declare it and will have to pay the 17.5 per cent VAT. We should note that our understanding is that you cannot claim back the Sales Tax from the USA, but even so you may save a small amount on the UK price.
For example: if you purchased a MacBook in San Francisco it would cost $1,299, plus 8.5 per cent sales tax, making the actual total $1,409. This is £814 in UK money, which, if you declare it at customs, will cost you a further £142.45 in VAT. Making for a total of £946 and a grand saving of £4. We should note that if you're visiting Alaska, or a place with lower Sales Tax, the saving can be higher.
If you purchase the extended three year AppleCare extended plan you'll get world-wide cover (Apple recommends doing this in your country of residence). It's worth noting that every member of the Macworld UK team visits San Francisco at least once a year, and not a single laptop we are currently running was purchased in the States. Although if you're popping over to Alaska it may make some sense.
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Comments received
Shane said on Fri, 17 Oct 2008
Try the Irish store - we get hit again by the Euro-Pound-Dollar conversion, with the result that we pay on average 10% *more* than UK Apple shoppers
Mvn said on Fri, 17 Oct 2008
no matter how you try to explain it away the prices for the MacBook, seen as the entry point for most people, are too expensive. The only way to force apple is too vote with your feet and not buy. I had assumed one of the reasons behind any manufacturing change is to lower cost, for most other pc manufacturer this lowers product end price but for apple the margins improve. Guess they are not interested in increasing Market share outside the US. A similar thing happened with the overpriced rev 1 of iPhone where they were forced to be more realistic at the second attempt. Guess they have not learnt any lessons from this.
gregorsamsa said on Fri, 17 Oct 2008
Though the 2 new MBs may be worth the price for those who love glossy & need powerful graphics, the refusal to sell the white, entry-level MB at £699 looks poor for Apple's image. Not impressed. I also think that 2GB RAM as standard would've been about right.
Kieran said on Fri, 17 Oct 2008
I think its about time somebody put a court case up about this like they would in America if the price were the other way round and effect them. Time To Take Action!
Russ said on Fri, 17 Oct 2008
I don't think anyone who has used a MacBook would compare it to the crappy laptops that roll out of PC World. loaded with 'extras' but really not that good. I would still pay more for a Mac.
Skanger in Dublin said on Fri, 17 Oct 2008
In fact, the price differential between the Irish (Euro) and the UK (Sterling) stores has narrowed with this shift in UK prices. Over the past year or so the UK prices (for MB, MBP and iMac) could vary between 8% and 16% lower than the Irish equivalents. Now, the prices are much closer (within about ±5%), and with the Irish price lower in some cases than the UK. The difference for the entry-level MacBook is minimal (about 0.1%). The opening of the Belfast Store may be relevant, but the currency fluctuations over the past 12 months are the main explanation. If it feels like rip-off Britain then I guess it's just your turn after a long spell of rip-off Ireland...
Andy said on Fri, 17 Oct 2008
I really wish Mercedes would bring their prices down a bit ! It's just not fair that their cars are too expensive for the common people to afford ! Waa Waaa ! :'(
Grow up - if you can't afford it, don't buy it. If you don't think it's worth it, don't buy it. If you think Apple should drop their prices, then not buying it is the best thing you can do - eventually they'll be forced to lower them.
SC said on Fri, 17 Oct 2008
Just a correction:
"So if a product costs £100 the retailer gives £17.50 of that straight to the government. "
is not correct. If the price were £117.50 then £17.50 would go to the 'VAT men'; for a £100 sale they only get £14.89
anonymous said on Fri, 17 Oct 2008
And what about the Microsoft rip-off tax? Vista, Office, XP, etc all cost about the same in UK £ as US dollars. I think that is the company (the convicted monopolist) that you should direct your anger too!
Natasha said on Fri, 17 Oct 2008
> if you can't afford it, don't buy it. If you don't think it's worth it,
> don't buy it.
Exactly. That's my plan. I was set to run out and buy one, but after having seen the offerings, 'm not buying anything at all. I don't want a mac that looks like a PC and I won't be buying a MacBook Ugly.
NB said on Fri, 17 Oct 2008
> if you can't afford it, don't buy it. If you don't think it's worth it,
> don't buy it.
don't worry - millions will be following you're wonderful advice.
Hacker1 said on Fri, 17 Oct 2008
>I don't think anyone who has used a MacBook would compare it to the crappy laptops that roll out of PC World.
My ACER 6920G has blue ray, 3gb ram, 16" screen, 250 gig drive and was still cheaper. 1 hour to install Hackintosh fully working.
Bob T said on Fri, 17 Oct 2008
Not impressed and not buying. I'll just make do with my old model and upgrade RAM from Crucial and get an external drive!
Paul said on Fri, 17 Oct 2008
im sure soon apple will release a cheaper laptop to fill the gap in the market, problem is they tried to make a cheap mac and made the mac mini, its totally over priced for the spec. so im sure a cheaper mac laptop will be the same. overpriced under spec.
Ian said on Fri, 17 Oct 2008
I just did a crude comparison with the iPod Touch prices, which did come down, thinking to find a difference but actually the price difference is similar. For the iPod Touch £169 is about 74% of $229 and £719 for the basic Macbook is about 72% of $999, with the other Macbooks and the Macbook Air in the 72-73% range. So Apple does seem to be consistent at least. Out of curiosity I looked at sony style.co.uk and sonystyle.com and the starting laptop in the Sony Vaio CS range is $1214.99 in the US and £899 in the UK, about 73%.
I still think the new model laptops are too expensive wherever you are, and that this will cost Apple market share. Perhaps that's what Apple want, to keep it exclusive. Personally I'd rather see as many people using Mac OS X as possible.
Matt P said on Fri, 17 Oct 2008
> > if you can't afford it, don't buy it. If you don't think it's worth it,
> > don't buy it.
> don't worry - millions will be following you're wonderful advice.
Yeah, but not until they have had a good old whinge about it on a blog or forum... sheesh!
Kevin Newell said on Fri, 17 Oct 2008
Apple set us up to think we would be seeing lower prices with their early announcement that stated they may be taking a hit and also with the speech stating a $100 price reduction. What they have effectively done is create a market hype which led us to believe the opposite of what they delivered. Hence we are all stunned and feel abused. Apple should have thought this one through a lot better - then again we are only the UK so why do they care? i'll be putting my purchase on hold until I know they have the message - do likewise and they will get the message all that bit quicker.
Mr Lizard said on Fri, 17 Oct 2008
@ SC:
"If the price were £117.50 then £17.50 would go to the 'VAT men'; for a £100 sale they only get £14.89"
Eh?
17.5% of the ticket price is VAT. So if the price on the shelf is £100, then £17.50 is VAT.
If the price was £117.50, then the VAT element would be £20.56
:-)
Alex said on Fri, 17 Oct 2008
Mr Lizard and SC you are both kinda right!!
it depends on whether the £100 included VAT or not?
Made me laugh anyway :-)
TB said on Fri, 17 Oct 2008
It's not a surprise that Apple is so far behind Microsoft. Won't be getting better anytime soon.
Steve H said on Fri, 17 Oct 2008
Either Mr Lizard does not understand VAT or he does not understand percentages.
VAT is levied at 17.5% on top of the sale price. So, a £100 item has £17.50 added to give a total of £117.50.
To work out the without-VAT price of an item from its with-VAT price you divide by 1.175. To work out the amount of VAT you take the with-VAT price, divide by 1.175, and then multiply the result by 0.175
So, an item that sells in a shop for £100 brings £85.106 to the shopkeeper and £14.894 to HM Revenue and Customs (and yes, they _will_ end up getting the fraction of a penny, because they calculate the shopkeeper's VAT bill on the _total_ amount the shop has sold in a particular time period, rather than on each individual item).
Sal said on Fri, 17 Oct 2008
It is a rip-off. There's nothing I can see that justifies the price increase. A year ago I could buy a MacBook at a certain price point. A year later the replacement Macs are more expensive. Like the article says, technology increases in power and prices come down. While I might forgive Apple for not lowering the prices it's simply a joke that they increase them. I don't care about the uni-body, glass trackapd, etc. They're cosmetic advances that do little for my computing needs so I find it disengenous that they are used to explain price hikes.
It's a tricky situation because I like OS X but just can't afford new hardware anymore, except for the Mac mini but that has become an embarrassment.
Kevin J said on Fri, 17 Oct 2008
Whilst it won't put me off buying completely it is certainly a public affairs shot in the foot - any little help in these financial times would help show that Apple UK was in touch with its customers.
Mark Hattersley said on Fri, 17 Oct 2008
SC is correct (sorry Sal). I have updated the story to take into account that the tax is added to the amount and not retrospectively deducted from the total amount.
As far as I know, all the other calculations are correct.
Steve H said on Fri, 17 Oct 2008
It's a bit of an own-goal for Apple isn't it?
The fact that the dollar has risen against the pound and the Euro means they couldn't easily give us a price cut, but the market is particularly price-sensitive at the moment, and there's a recession on the way, _and_ Apple aren't short of cash, so which daft beggar decided to set prices so that they were guaranteed to get howls of protest across most of Europe?
Apple: the company whose products we love but whose business practices we find frustrating as hell.
Alex said on Sat, 18 Oct 2008
You wanted to keep the Pound and made fun of the Euro? Well karma is a *itch... in "Euroland" the price of the base MacBook has indeed gone down.
Matt P said on Sat, 18 Oct 2008
Right, only 999 997 more to go... ;)
People do realise that we are now paying less for our Macbooks in net terms than three months ago right? It's just that the Pound Sterling lost 15% of its value making it look like a price increase.
Rocker said on Sat, 18 Oct 2008
>People do realise that we are now paying less for our Macbooks in net terms than three months ago right? It's just that the Pound Sterling lost 15% of its value making it look like a price increase.
It's down to value for money - a lot of people (current users and potential) obviously don't think Apple are in that bracket any more.
mvn said on Sat, 18 Oct 2008
it's always amusing to read how some people defend apple no matter what they do, they are a large multinational with the same business practices as Dell or Microsoft. Yes most people here agree they produce superior designs and elegant user interfaces but in todays world most people cannot justify spending 1K on a notebook in a Market where other competitors products are dropping in price. For most people the ability to browse or send emails is available several hundred pounds lower.
SC said on Sat, 18 Oct 2008
Hacker1 said on Friday, 17 October 2008
>My ACER 6920G has blue ray, 3gb ram, 16" screen, 250 gig drive and was still cheaper. 1 hour to install Hackintosh fully working.
Fully working? So how do you play Blu-ray™ discs on your hacked MacOS X then?
gregorsamsa said on Sat, 18 Oct 2008
@Matt P
>Yeah, but not until they have had a >good old whinge about it on a blog or >forum... sheesh!
Well at least people are having a "whinge" about what's unsuitable to them about these Macs. Much that I agree with. That's what the comments section is partly for.
Your comment is PURE WHINGE about others' comments. Some friendly advice, dude: if you don't like folk expressing opinion about MacBooks, pricing etc, then stay away & don't read it!
Hacker1 said on Sat, 18 Oct 2008
@SC
I can on my XP drive. Mac's are not that clever.
Roger said on Sat, 18 Oct 2008
It's difficult, perhaps, to compare the computer market with the automobile market. But with Daimler-Benz cutting car production by 40,000 (and possibly more) and deleting an entire line of US and Canadian-built trucks, is it really an advantage in the present climate to be the "Mercedes" of the market? I am just about to switch to a Mac, persuaded by the sheer enthusiasm of others who own them. But I fear that if Apple are so keen on their exclusivity that with the global economy going down the toilet they price themselves out of reach of most purchasers, there won't be many more switchers in the near future.
Matt P said on Sat, 18 Oct 2008
I dont think it comes as a surprise to anyone who has watched Apple for some time that they never wanted to become a mass-market vendor competing on price. We are completely free to vote with our wallets and not purchase any of their products. Multinational business is not charity and products will be priced at exactly the right level to achieve the intended sales. If sales keep on growing at a given price level there is no need to lower the price. This is why the rumoured price drop was unrealistic wishful thinking. Maybe if sales dropped by 30% instead of increasing then Apple would consider discounting like 4x4 cars are being sold at the moment.
Matt
John Crawford said on Sat, 18 Oct 2008
Apple has a successful business model judged by the last five years or so. Global pricing policies form part of this model, and Apple will have estimated sales volumes based on various price points for its products. See MattP's comment above.
Exchange rates have clearly been the most significant variable over the past 12 months as MW pointed out.
Apple may be wrong. They may have over-estimated sales. Equally they may have reduced their production targets so that they can maintain profit margins on lower sales volumes.
It may seem easy to second guess Apple's decisions from the perspective of a "I want a new MacBook, but don't like the new prices" stand point.
However, there is little point becoming emotional and trying to use that emotion to affect other readers on this forum. Just withhold your cash, or buy an alternative. Problem solved! Or do you really, really, secretly want a new MacBook?
B1254 said on Sat, 18 Oct 2008
I really don't see the big uproar. Apple have always been ridiculously expensive anyway.
The way i see it you get what you pay for!
jonathan Renouf said on Sat, 18 Oct 2008
I was going to upgrade but I'm not going to do so at these prices. Apple is a greedy company which pushes pricing to the absolute limit. Failing to compete on price is arrogant; as the commment from Hacker 1 makes clear, it is possible to get a PC that outperforms these MacBooks for less money. Apple hopes that the cachet of its name and image will make people pay over the odds. It's a shame; this is a company that could build market share AND maintain profitability if it had the heart. My only consolation is that I'm sure in the current climate it will be forced to cut prices or suffer a fairly dramatic fall in MacBook sales. The only question is will it happen before Christmas or after?
Graham said on Sat, 18 Oct 2008
I'm glad I bought my Black MB when I did :)
I think some people here think that Apple want to be Microsoft, they don't. Unfortunately, Apple's business model is supply and demand - like all companies. Demand is high, so put prices up. Compare specs to similar laptops elsewhere, and you will get same spec for less. You won't get a mac for less though.
Exclusivity with nVidia graphics for X amount of time ? New larger multi-touch trackpad ? New aluminum build ? OS X and it's software (with full support, not hackintosh!)
I'm not saying I agree with the price increase - I'd be bitching with the best of em If I was in the market to buy, but what Apple offer is a USP. Unique Selling Point. No other manufacturer can offer what they do. I build Systems, and as much as I love my Quad-Core O/C Monster of a PC, it's still not a Mac!
Graham said on Sat, 18 Oct 2008
And, as more then a few user's have said if it bothers you that much, vote with your feet - either buy a Ford/Honda or buy a Merc/Lexus. They do the same thing, one is cheaper and is bought by tens of millions and they are pretty happy with it. The other offers a more comfortable user experience for a higher premium and is bought a few million.
Also, look at this way - iPod's/iPhone's are paying the bills (and some)
Mac's are for the more hardcore Apple fan and are kinda like the cherry on top for Apple with the high markup they make.
This reminds me of an article I read regarding Nokia a few weeks ago - their taking hits in market share due to the economy but they don't care. Their stable, broad range of products, business as usual when market stability returns.
I think you're smoking illicit drugs if you think Apple's shares are gonna fall more then their competitor's though.
JayJay said on Sun, 19 Oct 2008
Same here in Australia - new prices are quite an unwelcome jump. No new MB Pro for me, I just can't see the value in it...
DJ said on Sun, 19 Oct 2008
I'm in the market for MBs and MBPs, but may well put off the purchase awhile. The increased prices are a PR shot in the foot, not least because MBs are widely used by students, hardly a breed known for having piles of cash.
Nik Gibson said on Sun, 19 Oct 2008
The central point is that US prices have remained stable while the UK price has gone up. In the case of the 2.4GHz MB as stated by £200. Even given your point about the £ depreciating against the $, how can that be justified?
Stephen North said on Sun, 19 Oct 2008
I would have thought that major manufacturers find it impractical to yo-yo their prices with exchange rates. They therefore pick a price and broadly speaking stick to it. The pound does appear to have dropped some 15-20% against the Dollar in the last year and doesn't look set to go back up any time soon. Perhaps this has the greatest influence on UK prices, our pound is not worth as much when buying goods which are set against US Dollar prices. Apple are a business they will do what they think is best for profits and will have considered this, how would you like a straight 17% increase? :) Btw. If you are a student the old white MacBook was perfectly adequate yesterday.....
Derek Hinwood said on Sun, 19 Oct 2008
Can't really see what all this fuss is about. The price points have changed,s lightly, in that there is effectively no 829 model, which is what I bought last time I purchased a Macbook (which I am still extremely happy with 18 months on). So far as I can see, for 719 you can now get a better model than the one I purchased 18 months ago. Seems fair. As for the model - this has far superior graphics ability, so if that is what you need, then adding an extra 100 to the 829 you were probably going to spend anyway doesn't seem so harsh. And if you are price sensitive, then 719 is a pretty good deal, compared to what Apple were offering one week ago, in that you get very usable machine with a Superdrive.
Derek Hinwood said on Sun, 19 Oct 2008
Can't really see what all this fuss is about. The price points have changed,s lightly, in that there is effectively no 829 model, which is what I bought last time I purchased a Macbook (which I am still extremely happy with 18 months on). So far as I can see, for 719 you can now get a better model than the one I purchased 18 months ago. Seems fair. As for the model - this has far superior graphics ability, so if that is what you need, then adding an extra 100 to the 829 you were probably going to spend anyway doesn't seem so harsh. And if you are price sensitive, then 719 is a pretty good deal, compared to what Apple were offering one week ago, in that you get very usable machine with a Superdrive.
Nik Gibson said on Sun, 19 Oct 2008
The central point is that US prices have remained stable while the UK price has gone up. In the case of the 2.4GHz MB as stated by £200. Even given your point about the £ depreciating against the $, how can that be justified?
Matt R said on Sun, 19 Oct 2008
I can't believe it! No, not the price hike of the new Apple laptops - the overall inability of such a large group of people to misunderstand Tax, £:$ exchange rates and global markets.
Next time you are reading your Apple manuals etc, take care to note that your kit is designed by Apple IN CALIFORNIA!! It's an American company of course the US price will remain stable.
Don't blame Apple for the price hike - blame our inept government for allowing the pound to slide in value!
U Pratt said on Sun, 19 Oct 2008
>blame our inept government for allowing the pound to slide in value!
Yea cos the crap lending practises by the American banks and the slide of the world economy does not come in to it.
TJ said on Sun, 19 Oct 2008
>The way i see it you get what you pay for!
Overpriced stuff that still breaks down as often as kit a third of the price.
Werewolf said on Mon, 20 Oct 2008
Hold on about the price slides. I bought my Macbook in September 2006 in the US for $1099. At the time it was selling in Ireland for €1099. Throughout the fall in value of the dollar, the price of the Macbook over here DID NOT VARY FOR CURRENCY FLUCTUATIONS. (I am open to correction, btw. I'm not claiming infallibility, despite my allcaps.) So that means the company received a massive premium over the period that the dollar was weak. And as the Chinese currency was more or less pegged to the dollar, the manufacturing costs didn't vary. My solution as I come up to upgrade time for my beloved (and first) Apple, is to wait until I can get someone going to the US (or if I'm lucky, I go myself) and get it there. The Apple service is exceptional worldwide if there's an issue, and blows the socks of all other manufacturers.
Big British Beef said on Mon, 20 Oct 2008
Prices were lower in the UK than in the rest of EUROpe last year. People were exporting and reselling from Gatwick Airport´s Dixons Duty Free to the rest of the world in the past months. Of course, it would not stay like this for ever. Britain is alltogether rediculously expensive, but Apple macs are cheaper than elsewhere.
German Guy said on Mon, 20 Oct 2008
Yes, I agree. Flying out from London is a fantastic opportunity to upgrade your gear.
E1 said on Mon, 20 Oct 2008
More Expensive and no Firewire!!!
Rip Off!
Jeff said on Mon, 20 Oct 2008
Buy a used Macbook from ebay - you'll save a fortune and still have the OS you want with Firewire, naturally be picky with your purchase. There's quite a few on there now that the new ones are out therefore bargains to be had.
William Clark said on Mon, 20 Oct 2008
Maybe Apple could 'revolutioniset the market' and only have an online international store with prices in US dollars - so you pay based on the exchange rate day in your contry???? This sounds like something SJ would like to stir the market up with.
Gina said on Mon, 20 Oct 2008
>The Apple service is exceptional worldwide
At a high price, a lot of companies are now bundling 3 year warranties as standard. It still wont encourage me to buy another.
Vince said on Mon, 20 Oct 2008
My company delayed the purchase of MacBooks until the upgrades were announced, we are now staying with Windows. 400 sales lost here in Bristol.
Matt said on Mon, 20 Oct 2008
I have to say that i bought a new Macbook for my wife at the weekend. I was annoyed with Apple but it is a great product. What i find more interesting is the pricing differences in the US and UK store between say the Mac Mini or when the ATV launched with 2.0 and the 160GB drive but the price in the Uk remained the same for the 40Gb and more expensive for the larger capacity model. There are definatly issues and Apple knows exactly where they can exploit the loyal fan base. Itouch software update charges anyone?
Kris said on Mon, 20 Oct 2008
Euro customers pay more - but in most EU countries there's a full 2 year warranty. And that counts a lot. BTW, take a look at Canadian prices, add about 13% of tax...
Denis said on Mon, 20 Oct 2008
I'm only speaking for professionals here, and that's the market I assume the MacBook Pro is aimed at. Firstly VAT is recouped, reducing the price by almost 20%. The machine is tax deductible, reducing the cost by up to 40% more. Of course as a professional it earns its keep. Then it's sold on eBay in order to upgrade. Bottom line: the laptop makes a good profit and is a cheap, productive, advanced business tool from the makers of the best computers. No complaints about price here!
Denis said on Mon, 20 Oct 2008
I'm only speaking for professionals here, and that's the market I assume the MacBook Pro is aimed at. Firstly VAT is recouped, reducing the price by almost 20%. The machine is tax deductible, reducing the cost by up to 40% more. Of course as a professional it earns its keep. Then it's sold on eBay in order to upgrade. Bottom line: the laptop makes a good profit and is a cheap, productive, advanced business tool from the makers of the best computers. No complaints about price here!
Tim Winfield said on Mon, 20 Oct 2008
You can buy a decent spec PC Laptop running some flavour of Vista for around £4 - 500 in the UK now. These machines will not have the build quality of an Apple Laptop or the beauty of OS X but are around half the price of a new Apple Macbook. Nothing in Apple’s laptop range is now aimed at the lower end of the market. This seems a really odd move when they are continuing to grow market share and Laptops are their best seller. It seems an odd and insensitive move in the current financial climate. With Apple's vast profits and cash reserves from the last few years, I hoped they might have retained the old Macbook form factor as a lower end machine, bumped up the specs and lowered the price to around the £5 - 600 mark in the UK (ideally perhaps even lower). What they seem to have done instead is priced themselves back up into the niche end of the market just as there is less money around and they were starting to challenge the perception that Apple gear is always more expensive.
Suresh said on Mon, 20 Oct 2008
At the end of the day get what you pay for.
If your obsessed with the highest spec'd processor, RAM, HDD and screen size... then you will find a lot of cheaper products..
But remember you are buying a MacBook which now even has the most robust build quality -- Aircraft grade Aluminium!
and the best Operating System available on the market -- OS X.
theres no point in comparing prices of PC laptops with the new MacBooks...
The raw power of the NVidia GPU's will allow untold applications to be run when OS X (10.6) Snow Leopard comes out.. because it will be able to take advantage of the extra GPU cores.
Also don't forget GPU assisted H.264 encoding and decoding now..
and believe me once you have tried the 1/2/3/4 finger gestures on the new MacBooks -- using a mouse will look decidedly backwards.
In short, you get what you pay for -- and if you want a Mac you will buy -- if you dont want it badly enough -- you wont -- you'll get an inferior Vista laptop.
Denis said on Mon, 20 Oct 2008
I'm only speaking for professionals here, and that's the market I assume the MacBook Pro is aimed at. Firstly VAT is recouped, reducing the price by almost 20%. The machine is tax deductible, reducing the cost by up to 40% more. Of course as a professional it earns its keep. Then it's sold on eBay in order to upgrade. Bottom line: the laptop makes a good profit and is a cheap, productive, advanced business tool from the makers of the best computers. No complaints about price here!
Vince said on Mon, 20 Oct 2008
It was lots of things that lost the sale, mainly loss of Firewire which would mean replacing too much removable media.
MJohn said on Mon, 20 Oct 2008
>you'll get an inferior Vista laptop.
That's crap. Many laptops are spec'd way above the macbooks now. You don't have to have Vista, XP is still available and is the biggest used OS in the world for one reason - it is bloody good at it's job.
If it was not then we would see OS X on every corporate desktop - which will never happen.
alastair said on Mon, 20 Oct 2008
> XP is still available and is the biggest used OS in the world for one reason
> - it is bloody good at it's job.
It has *nothing* to do with XP being good (or otherwise).
It has rather more to do with the large number of unimaginative dull-witted morons who moved into IT in the 1990s. We're talking about people who need to go on a course to work a blasted coffee machine. Small surprise that, having gone on their Microsoft courses, they only want to buy Windows and Windows-based products.
MJohn said on Mon, 20 Oct 2008
@alastair
Total whimpering dribble. I have worked with all variations of OS's over the past twenty years and the reason no-one buys Apple is because it is tied to hardware, expensive hardware. Why spend that sort of money and tie yourself into one supplier? Makes no sense.
If, for instance my hardware supplier drops Fire Wire and wont move forward to Blue Tooth but another supplier does, I can simply switch to the hardware supplier without having to purchase another OS, re-write all the company software & retrain all the staff.
Ascylto said on Tue, 21 Oct 2008
@ Mjohn ...
Alastair is still correct (if not quite so vehemently expressed). The reasons Window is so widespread is because most people don't use their machines as computers but rather as workstations. Most people haven't a clue about computers. Microsoft have abused their position of power (as proved in the courts) to make corporate ownership of Windows a cheap option.
Most IT departments in companies are Windows based. Like the turkeys, they're not going to vote for Christmas.
As regards XP being good ... I agree - by comparison with Vista, XP is superb!. But let's not forget what went before ... an absolute hornets' nest of problems ... it took years to 'fix'.
CW_Staff said on Tue, 21 Oct 2008
Forgive me if this has been said, but I suspect the reason Apple has not decreased prices is a higher build cost. I'm no 'green' fanatic, but I can see that Apple are making a determined effort to make computers that are more environmentally friendly.
Apple are not stupid, so I expect that they fully appreciate the 'green' PR that they get, and perhaps lower taxes in some regions. However, I do suspect that various changes like arsenic-free glass and the aluminium case will have cost them more than if they had just modified on the old basis. A lot of the R&D will take time/money to gain back, so build costs will reduce.
I drive 30K+ miles per year in a big car so can't claim to be green, but I still applaud Apple for making steps in the right direction. And yes I am prepared to pay 'something' for that.
I think the PC manufacturers will struggle to follow Apple without also increasing prices (or at least failing to reduce them).
Rob.
dennis said on Tue, 21 Oct 2008
Apple have never had a problem offering consumers a wide range of ipods at prices to suit all pockets, so why can't they manage the same with their computers?
Klaus said on Tue, 21 Oct 2008
The $/£ exchange rate is a smoke screen. None of Apple's products are made in the US, but in China. This makes accurate calculations of retail prices in the UK difficult but not impossible.
mark ryder said on Tue, 21 Oct 2008
BLAH BLAH BLAH BLAH>> sorry but I gave up with all the BLah Blah excuses and attempts of bias to Apple inc reasoning which is really all spin spin spin !!! The laptop price is huge in comparable products chip speed ram/storage ect..ect I know pcs are rubbish but Apple seems to be really over pricing the worst over rated laptop upgrade as its all superficial , no real processing improvements wheres the processing power apple are squeezing their product life with a case new case because ideas have run dry and processor speeds seem to be dropping rather than increasing!!
i wont be buying this round of laptops
Matt P said on Tue, 21 Oct 2008
@ Klaus
It might seem that way but as Apple is an American company with their profit measured in USD they can't afford to bet their entire company on the currency market and would so tie their supplier contracts to dollars by either paying them in dollars or by currency hedging.
I was looking at buying the new 2.0 Aluminium Macbook in the US but it works out more expensive than from the Apple store here so I'm not going to risk it. ($1299 + $113 NYC tax / 1.7 = £831 + £145 VAT = £976) I would have to either break the law to jump through hoops to buy it cheaper in the US than back at home.
Matt
jand102821 said on Wed, 22 Oct 2008
I guess the best way to look at the apple price in the uk is what else can i get for the money. 95% of business in the UK use PC's and notebooks so Mac is really only selling to individuals.
Would you as a consumer rather spend £949 on, and give Mac credit here a much better computing system or would you rather do this:-
42 inch LCD TV
and blue ray dvd player, and depending on how much the TV is, something much more inovative than apple products a Nintendo Wii.
I know what i'd rather spend my money on in this climate, and it doesn't have an apple on it!!
Still at least the profite from the iPhone have kept Apple in good stead, so I guess they wont be to concerned;)
MatthewL said on Mon, 27 Oct 2008
I guess the yanks will be coming over here to buy their cheap Apple puters now!
Apple's pricing was always fair to the UK. They can't shift prices quickly so are always having to take on currency risk. And having to put up with ill-informed consumer criticism.
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