Fri, 13 Nov 2009 Rogue Amoeba Software - Apple App Store is broken

Father Ted said on Fri, 13 Nov 2009

Interesting counter argument?

iphonedevelopment.blogspot.com/2009/11/rogue-amoeba.html

David Johnston said on Fri, 13 Nov 2009

Let’s see:

RA used copyrighted images without permission, having no right whatsoever to do so. RA got away with this breach in the first submission of their application. RA decides to update their app using the same images.

Concurrent to RA’s submission of its revised app, and as the whole Mac world knows, Apple tightened control over its copyrighted images for all AppStore submissions. The company rejected dozens of submissions, including a number of hight profile apps, for this very reason. The Internet was awash with these stories two months ago. Horror of horrors, Apple opts to protect its copyrighted images and thereby interfere with developers improperly using them. Imagine that.

Meanwhile RA assumes that, because it got away with using Apple’s copyrighted images earlier, it was perfectly entitled to continue using them. Something akin to assuming if you steal a chocolate bar and get away with it, you are entitled to continue stealing. Grow up RA and stop the silliness.

Dragonfly said on Fri, 13 Nov 2009

I think it's very important that Apple checks the quality of applications and can check for potential viruses, spyware etc... It must be a daunting task to check all the 100,000+ apps and their bug fixes / updates.

Obviously one person isn't checking all of these Apps, so it's a large team of people checking Apps based on their interpretation of a set of rules. Rules that probably adapt as new ideas and unforeseen boundaries (perhaps legal / liability ones) are crossed.

There are bound to be instances where one checker approves something and another questions something. That's the nature of things when many people are involved.

I can see that adding an Apple logo to your product could be something that could be called into question, even if it was agreed earlier. I think some developers need to be a bit patient.

parv said on Fri, 13 Nov 2009

i think it's silly for Rogue Amoeba to focus on mac software and give up on the iphone. I rarely buy new mac software but buy lots of iphone software. The iphone OS is where the growth is.

GH said on Fri, 13 Nov 2009

More markets are emerging, a sensible company has to evolve with it.

@David Johnston said on Fri, 13 Nov 2009

Don't magazines and websites use Apple logos and images everyday without problems? Seems a bit petty. The lack of actual dialogue here appears to be the issue also some apps clearly not fit for purpose can through okay. Guess it is is down to the employee doing the approval?

Mark Hattersley said on Fri, 13 Nov 2009

We do, and Apple makes imagery available for this purpose. Although it has to be said we do so carefully and with full acknowledgement of the original copyright, trademarking and fair purpose.

Things change when you move outside of publishing and into program development (because Apple makes software).

We might use the iTunes logo next to a story about iTunes, for example, but I wouldn't dream of creating an Macworld music program and using the iTunes logo as its Dock icon, for example (because I like my job and it'd be a shame to lose it ;-)

alastair said on Fri, 13 Nov 2009

@David Johnston:
No, RA *didn't* use copyrighted images without permission. *Apple* provides an API on Mac OS X to obtain precisely the images that RA was using, and added this API specifically so that developers could get access to them.

It's important to get your facts straight, otherwise you'll misunderstand the nature of their complaint.

Gabriel said on Fri, 13 Nov 2009

@ Father Ted - THANK YOU for the link to the much-needed "other side" of this story.

I think everyone agrees that Apple needs to improve things in the App Store, but RA's stubbornness and immaturity in this situation definitely puts everything in much clearer perspective.

dejo said on Fri, 13 Nov 2009

One of our apps, CraigsHarvest, was once rejected because we used the Setting app icon in our help file, in an attempt to direct users where to make settings changes. We even used a cropped version. Apple still rejected it!

SalmonFish said on Fri, 13 Nov 2009

Come on David, that's a very rigid view of what's going on here - maybe you should grow up and appreciate these people are trying to run their business, and apple has made it unnecessarily difficult; the length of your post reflects the fact that this is in fact a pointless, pedantic, petty and unproductive hoo-ha caused primarily by Apple's lack of flexibility and efficiency in dealing with software developers (and IMO in their approach to software and programming intercompatibility in general....)

Father Ted said on Fri, 13 Nov 2009

Worth a read as well
daringfireball.net/2009/11/airfoil_touch_situation

Father Ted said on Fri, 13 Nov 2009

Worth a read as well
daringfireball.net/2009/11/airfoil_touch_situation

Red Jones said on Fri, 13 Nov 2009

Worth a read too:


www.infoworld.com/d/mobilize/iphone-app-store-roulette-tale-rejection-773

Adam said on Sun, 15 Nov 2009

@David Johnston

Rogue Amoeba have address the misconception you have about their use of copyright images in a blog post www.rogueamoeba.com/utm/2009/11/13/airfoil-speakers-touch-correcting-misconceptions/

Simply speaking:
No copyright images are held on the iPhone
The copyright images are available via a Mac OS X API for developers to reasonably use in apps
Airfoil for the Mac uses this API, and transmits the images to Airfoil for the iPhone. It does a similar thing with the AppleTV.

The silly thing about this is that this is a fair use of the images and RA would be able to use these images without obstacle for an Android or Windows Mobile app, it's just misapplied iPhone rules that are acting as a barrier.

The review process needs to be reviewed, and urgently.

JacktheMac said on Wed, 18 Nov 2009

"The review process needs to be reviewed, and urgently."

Whatever one's views on the Apple v. RA debate, I think this is indisputable and would be to the benefit of developers, users - and Apple.